Highest Self Podcast 290: How To Free Yourself From Society’s Domestication with Tatyana Rae

We GO THERE in this episode. If you’re ready to free your mind from limiting beliefs, scarcity stores, societal conditioning, ancestral fears and all the domestication society places upon us, this episode is for you. Tatyana Rae is a Shaman, healer and freedom mentor who is 69-years-old and looks like she’s 45 because she can’t tell a lie. In this episode she shares how lies create lines and how we can live in our full authentic truth by getting radically REAL with ourselves.

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Episode 290: How To Free Yourself From Society’s Domestication with Tatyana Rae
By Sahara Rose


Namaste. It’s Sahara Rose and welcome back to The Highest Self Podcast, a place where we discuss what makes you, Your Soul’s Highest Evolvement. 


It is officially summer, and even though it may be a different summer than we are all used to, summer is here; Earth is still doing her natural shifts and we are part of this beautiful Universe. And being part of this beautiful Universe means being in touch with our true authentic selves; releasing ourselves from societal conditioning; cultural conditioning; all of the masks that we wear, that we were made to believe were here to make us feel safe or make us belong or we wouldn’t be loved if we didn’t wear those masks. And now, with this experience of 2020, it is becoming more and more clear that it is time to unveil ourselves from the bullshit and step into the truth of who we are from micro and macro-level.


And our guest today Tatyana Rae is such a fierce example of this. So, I met Tatyana Rae back in January; she was speaking at my friend Sarah Pendrix’s event and she got on stage with her like, see-through heels, her dress, she’s 69 years old like, more glammed-up than all of us there, even though we were walking through the sand, she’s like “I don’t take off my heals.” And, she just goes on that stage; and her thing is just that she can’t tell a lie; she only spits truth. And some of the things that she said made people feel really uncomfortable. She’s definitely one to call people out if they’re not being completely authentic to who they are and saying what they believe. And we are not used to this in our society, we’re so used to cushioning what we say to make other people feel comfortable; speaking between the lines; being passive-aggressive; not truly saying how we feel; and then kind of living in this world where everyone is lying. And I know in Persian culture there’s actually a word for this called Tarof – that we are taught to do as children, and she don’t play those games. 


She is a Shaman; a healer; a freedom mentor, who trained with Don Miguel Ruiz for almost a decade, and grew up, as she’ll tell us, with an Apache parent and a Mexican shamanic parent – so completely growing up with that wisdom and that tradition; later trained to become a psychologist; worked as a therapist; and realized that she didn’t want to just do counseling or even make people think that there’s anything wrong with them. As she says in this episode “There’s nothing wrong with you; there’s nothing you need to heal; you are not broken; it’s just that you aren’t telling the truth.” 


So, this to me, is such an important conversation to have because so often we’re like “I’m broken; I’m fixed; I have no ambition; I have no drive; I’m not lovable; I’m not this; I’m not that.” And we put all these labels on ourselves that make to believe the true, and we’re not really being honest with what is the belief underneath that, you know, and sometimes truth can hurt, as Lizzo says “Truth hurts.”  But maybe when you tell yourself the story of “I’m not ambitious” – it’s that you’re lazy and you prioritize watching Netflix over pursuing your dreams; or maybe when you say “Oh I keep dating fuck-boys; I can never stay in a committed relationship.” Oh, well, maybe you’re just repeating the trauma from your childhood over and over and over again but you’re not willing to fully be seen, you know. So, that can be difficult for us to look at but if we don’t actually look at it then we’re going to continue to repeat it and that doesn’t mean that that lie is your permanent truth; it just may mean that is an aspect of yourself that you have overlooked – your shadow self, that now needs to be healed.


So, we go there in this Episode. Just listening to Tatyana Rae speak, you’re going to be like “Mm-hmm; mm-hmm.” And I love her, you know, she always says “Lines are created by lies” – like lines on your face and wrinkles, because she looks so glam; she looks like she’s like 40 years old at 69 and it’s just such a beautiful expression of being your full authentic self, without holding back; without worrying or wondering what people think. She is like, “This s who I am, I’m showing up like that”, and that really gives us the invitation to do the same in whatever that looks like in our lives.

So, this is a powerful conversation – I know you’re going to be blown away by her wisdom and just ‘real deal no BS truth.’ 


So, without further ado, let’s welcome Tatyana Rae on The Highest Self Podcast.


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[06:24] Interview

[06:24] Sahara:

Welcome Tatyana to The Highest Self Podcast. It’s so great to have you here 

[06:27] Tatyana:

Thank you so much for inviting me, I’m really excited. Thank you. 

[06:31] Sahara:

The first question I’d love to ask you is what makes you your highest self?

[06:35] Tatyana:

Oh. Give me a minute, or a second. Okay, let’s see, what makes me my highest self? 

The fact that I want to tell the truth. The fact that I live to live what I’m feeling. It might sound like I’m not being considerate to others, but, really, I’m my highest self because I move according to how I feel. And when you’re happy, you don’t want to do ill to anybody, you know. You really don’t have it in your consciousness to hurt anybody’s feelings. In fact, that there can get misunderstandings – of course; but it wasn’t your intention; it wasn’t my intention. 

So, I would say I am my highest self because I move according to how I move and trust it. 

[07:28] Sahara:

I love that, and you truly are a beautiful example in living in your radical truth. So, a lot of Podcast listeners who are at the stage of their lives that they are really looking for their purpose. They don’t really know if they have a purpose; where to find one. What advice do you have for someone on this journey?


Your purpose. I think the word ‘purpose’ will confuse you. I really feel very strongly, like, “Did I have a purpose? Did I know that I had a purpose? Do I even know what my purpose is now?” Well, I’ve given myself a purpose in terms of a little ditty that I say, okay. But really, our purpose is to love and be kind. And I like to say “Don’t shit in the cosmic pool.” You know, because there’s so many people, Sahara, that will be doing wonderful work; and their yoga work; and their breathwork; and be all wonderful, and then go home and have these huge fights with their husband. Do you understand how I’m saying it? Or they’re really not that nice to people at work. It’s an all-the-time thing. So, purpose, they want their purpose. First let your purpose be to watch yourself; to get to know yourself and how you’re interacting with life – let that be your purpose first. Let that be your true purpose to see “How am I interacting with life as it approaches me?” And then I see, you know, believe it or not, a purpose starts to make itself known; it starts to unfold before you. I feel like that there are people that are helper-bees; there are people that are teachers; there are people that are so compassionate; there are people that just want to get things done, you know, but they’re good at getting things done; there’s visionaries, you see. And I feel that as you truly interact with each moment, not looking for your purpose, but looking how you’re interacting, that’s going to lead you to you and how you want to act in life, which is part of your purpose. 

[09:43] Sahara:

Yes, I think our purpose is always changing. I think we look for a purpose like it’s this one thing and once I find it everything is good. But your purpose, at any given moment, I mean your purpose in every given relationship is different. So, it’s hard to have this one thing that doesn’t exist. 

[09:59] Tatyana:

Absolutely. It’s so restricting. Really, I try and stay away from purpose because I say “Don’t have goals, have visions” because goals are structured “I want to lose 10lbs”, that’s a structure, but if you say “I want to be healthy”, then, there’s room for it to morph. First, maybe you lose the 10lbs; then maybe you start gaining some, I don’t know, your muscles start looking better; then you start changing how you eat. All along you’re working towards health, but you see how many different aspects of health can be integrated. As opposed to “I want to lose 10lbs.” So, then what, you stop eating or something; you lose the 10lbs, and are you healthy? Did you do it in a good way? I mean, what kind of food are you eating? You see all of the different things that are not integrated. 

Purpose puts you in a box. Have a vision for yourself so that it can morph according to the moment. In the end, we are life, we are life, and life will respond. Don’t put yourself in situations where you can’t respond. And I also don’t believe that, you know, just because you have an 8am-5pm job that you’re this unsuccessful person, that seems to be the norm right now. If you have a job-job that you’re not successful; that you’re not living your purpose – that’s not true, you see. How are you in that job? How do they need you? How do they use you? What are you offering as life, as self?  

[11:37] Sahara:

Yeah. One hundred percent. I don’t believe that everybody is meant to be an entrepreneur and that it is important for us to even be okay if our purpose is, you know, some people’s purpose – they genuinely want to be a mom or just, they want to have an easy life by the beach, and, that’s okay too. We actually need people holding all levels of vibration, and that’s why I like the word ‘Dharma’ over ‘Purpose’, because your Dharma is your soul’s expression; it’s the frequency that you emit, but it’s not defined by one career. 

[12:07] Tatyana:

Absolutely. And you see, we keep saying the word, but we keep trying to assist people to get away from the word – define, define, defined, definite, place, box – you know, no! No! Just let there be a flow. It’s expression, expression. I love what, Dharma – give me that again.

[12:28] Sahara

Dharma, yeah. 

[12:29] Tatyana

Yes, I know the word, but I didn’t know what it actually meant the way you just said it. An expression of life – yes. It’s beautiful, you see. 

And, so, what we’re talking about right now is – we’re talking about. Are you allowing this expression? And that’s going to change (if you want it to change). Oh my God, I mean if things didn’t change, we would still be the egg and the spermatozoid wouldn’t be there, we’d be the egg that’s for sure, in our mother’s fallopian tube. And, I’m not being ridiculous, we’re talking about change. You want change. We went from being the egg, to being the zygote, to being the embryo, to being the baby, to being the infant, you see. And now, here we are, in this beautiful adult body (young adult bodies – if you’re listening to me, young adults), and you’re still shifting and changing and that’s the beauty, the beauty is the flow of life, going through you and shifting how you’re able to present it each moment. 

[13:34] Sahara:

Yes. I think a huge reason why people don’t know what that expression is, is because of the obligations. Whether it’s from the family, society. Can you talk a little bit about the obligations that we have, for everyone around us, and how to free ourselves from them? 

[13:50] Tatyana:

Yes. The obligations we have always arise from domestication – but culture – we really have to pay attention to our cultures. I think that is an aspect of everybody’s life that’s listening, but you’re not really paying attention to. I know that many people are reaching to you for the Ayurvedic and ancient sciences. You know, with me being a shaman, they come to me a lot of times for the mysticism. Quite frankly, I don’t practice that. I can, but I don’t. I really try and bring it into common sense and something than can be used in today’s world. But, also, we have people of Irish heritage, German heritage, Algerian heritage, you see. What did your people practice in terms of spirituality? And, so, a lot of times what holds you back is not understanding your culture; not understanding your nest energy. What is it that you’re steeped in? And once you can begin to recognize it, become more familiar with it – you’ll understand more of its restrictions; you’ll understand… I come from an Apache-Latin background, Mexican, and they’re very family-oriented people, and they’re very culturally-oriented people. This is how it’s been done for hundreds of years, you know. And, so, when I broke out and broke away from that, there was a lot of upset; they are not happy. My own particular mentor is very not happy that I am as open as I am about my personal life, you see. And what these people that can do that are listening to us right now is understand. You’re like a little tea bag that got steeped in the waters of your family history. Understand the family history first, don’t fight it – understand the family history; understand where these people are coming from and why they’re judging you the way they are; and what’s inhibiting you in terms of their judgments. And then yes, there is going to have to come a moment, Sahara, when we let go and we have to accept, in our understanding of where they stand, that we no longer stand there. 

[16:06] Sahara:

I think that a lot of people are afraid of that ‘letting go’. They don’t even know what that ‘letting go’ looks like, you know, so. We were just speaking about my own life as an example, so we could use that as an example because my audience kind of knows my situation. But for someone, let’s say who grew up in a more traditional culture, where you kind of sacrificed your own needs and desires for the sake of the family; it had more of a tribal upbringing of you do what was the best for the whole, and if you’re not – you’re selfish; you’re egotistical; you’re essentially not honoring your parents the way that they should by not listening to their advice and suggestion. 

How does someone break free from something as strong as that that is truly ancestral?

[16:48] Tatyana:

It is ancestral; and it is something that you must then create another family that supports you. This is very true. We are pack animals essentially is the word I like to say. We are pack animals. We need those puppy piles, you know. When you see the little puppies in cages when they’re first born and you wonder how do they not suffocate, you know, the way they’re piled on top. We need that energy, and that touch, and that closeness, so when we do decide to go and express ourself, and our family does not support how we are choosing to express ourself, it is very, very true that you do absolutely need a family, I hear the word ‘tribe’ going around right now, you need a tribe, a village, you need people that understand what you’re attempting to create; that support your vision; that are happy for you – they’re just happy for you, you see. And that is – yes, it is very true – you are going to leave one family, but it is essential that you have another family to support you. Even if it’s one person, even if it’s one person, you see. 

And in my case, I would say that one person that absolutely supports me is my husband. And talking about having people leave you – my husband is German, and his family is in Luxembourg and Germany, and when he got married with me, he decided to stay in America, whereas he used to live bi-coastally. And when he decided to stay in America predominantly, it was a great upset, it was an enormous upset, and he was pretty much cast out, you see. But he stood by what he needed to express as himself, which was to be in this country – and his family is me and the friends we’ve made; and my family, my mentor, not always in sync with what I share, and so, my support system, that I completely trust, is my husband. And then, believe it or not, it would be the viewers, it would be who’s listening; and when you write in; when I post something on Instagram, you know, and they’ll write something very sweet to me. You cannot imagine how empowering that is; how it makes me feel loved, loved, you see, loved. And that’s what we want from our families – to feel loved; accepted.

[19:19] Sahara:

I agree with that and I do believe that a lot of people do give a lot of hate to social media, and there are shadow sides, but the same for me,  when I was leaving my family structure of figuring out what my path would look like, and they didn’t understand why I was sharing everything on the internet; and that was so weird; I am an exhibitionist; I’m so attention hungry, and all these things. But it was because of the transformation that I would see in making other people’s lives by me; sharing would keep me going that in a way I felt more connected, and I still do, a hundred percent today, feel more connected to my audience to the person listening to this than I might to the people who raised me because I’ll always be grateful for them. And the person who listens to me now understands where I’m at, at this point of time and not loving me for the sake of blood relationships, and I think a lot of the reasons why we’re even visiting people, talking to them, spending holidays with them, is simply because we have this blood relationship with them.

[20:19] Tatyana: 

Like you said – obligation. And let the truest love comes from desire; curiosity. The truest, deepest love comes from intimacy. You know, when you and I were at that LA Girl Talk Festival (not too long ago, in January) I spoke to many of the audience members, and the way they would hug me, the way they would kiss me, the way the smiled, the way they laughed at anything I would share on stage – that’s a sister.

[20:52] Sahara: 

Well, I think also, you’re the Elder; and you’re a mother figure that a lot of us people never had. 

[20:58] Tatyana: 


[20:59] Sahara: 

Completely open and free and expressed, and not telling us what to do, which I think a lot of women have dealt with.

[21:05] Tatyana: 

Absolutely! And I feel I have a very, very privileged position right now, very privileged because I am a Crone; at 69 I am a Crone, and I love that. I have a perspective of time, wisdom (it’s become wisdom), but I’m also – my perception is not clouded by that time. So, I still have the ability to be in the moment, and to appreciate what’s going on and how it’s changing. And I love laughing at myself because dear little audience, I’m catching up to all of the media and how to use the computers and everything like that, and I love watching myself bumble through it.

I remember when the microwaves came out and my mother would scream at us “Come into the microwave” and we would say “Oh, mother! All you have to do is push this and this.” But now I understand when my son’s repeating “Oh, mom, all you have to do is push this and this.”

So, it’s a beautiful place, the audience, I really want the audience to hear, the audience is such a support; it’s such a dear, dear, dear support; and it’s so valued, you all are so valued. When we look out and see you in the audience, or when we read your comments, or when we meet you in the street – it’s a beautiful feeling; that’s my family now, yes!

[22:37] Sahara: 

One hundred percent. 

So, you have this really interesting perspective that we aren’t born here to learn lessons but rather we are to enjoy. Can you share on that more?

[22:50] Tatyana: 

Absolutely. You’ve all heard this is a school room; Earth is a school room. No! No! Earth is a part of Paradise. We were meant to come here and enjoy ourselves; enjoy our curiosity; enjoy our intellect; enjoy our creativity; to revel in everything that we could possibly contrive for ourselves. And then we decided to just stick it out; you know, you get into a relationship – I’m learning lessons – don’t, don’t! Like I said to Sahara at one point, I’m in my garden and if I plant in the wrong place and it dies I go “Oops, not going to do that again!” For me, there’s ‘oops days’ and ‘yay days’ and I either have a ‘yay day’ or an ‘oops day’ but I’m not out to learn lessons. I am, however, paying attention; I’m paying attention to what I’m doing; I’m paying attention to my interaction with my environment, and I will be learning from that. But I don’t set out to do something to see what’s going to happen so I can learn a lesson – No! No! We’re not that stupid.

[24:03] Sahara: 

I mean, I think it really shows that we do create our reality, and if you set that intention of “ This Earth is here for me to enjoy and to revel in, and to have fun and the best time ever”, then that’s what’s going to show up for us, and if we have – A lot of people choose to learn through pain; they believe “The only way I can grow is through pain” and I believe they keep choosing situations that make them suffer. 

How do we end for those people who subconsciously keep finding that they’re in the most difficult situation and that’s the only way that they could change which, I think a lot of people have had to deal with that near death experience; but some people are living in a near death experience. 

How do you choose to no longer grow through suffering and instead grow through joy? And is it possible to surely learn through joy without the suffering?

[24:53] Tatyana: 

Yes. What happens is, do not get accustomed to suffering; don’t get addicted to suffering. Right now, we’re addicted to suffering. And have you ever considered that once you’re not suffering – if you really begin to apply the work; if you really begin to apply your workshops and your books and everything that everybody’s sharing. If you begin to apply it step by step, I say, you’re frightened. What’s going to happen if I don’t have anything to complain about? What’s going to happen when it’s all going smoothly? What am I going to do with all of this time? What am I going to do with this Joy? Am I going to have to interact with people more? Once I’m happy, am I going to have to be with people? Am I going to have to talk to people? These are all the little dark corners of ourselves that we don’t look at, that we won’t let ourselves look at. As long as I’m in some kind of turmoil; okay, it’s up to me and I’m always trying to figure out how I’m going to get out of it, but the moment I have no turmoil, the moment I don’t have consequences anymore, what am I going to do with myself? People are, I say, we’re terrified of having to interact with one another; of having to relate. And really, in the end, we go back to the pack animals, and the little dogs and cats and kitties, and I don’t know, even giraffes have herds.

So, relating, you’re going to relate; as long as you have these consequences that you’re trying to untangle, you can keep your head down and you can say “Oh, I’m working toward” and you can look like you’re working toward, but you’re not; you’re evading; you’re evading that eventual relationship with life. And life is waiting there with open arms, with hugs and kisses. There’s no lessons, it’s not going to say “Oh my God, where the fuck were you all this time?” It’s just going to hug you and kiss you and toil you around! So yeah, you’re evading; you are evading if you continue to create some kind of chaos, because the chaos means you do not want to change; you don’t not want to change. You want life to change, but you don’t want to change. 

[27:28] Sahara:  

And I feel like what you’re really saying is that it’s not that it’s not going to be challenging, we’re definitely going to have challenges, but those challenges are for the purpose of you choosing your relishment, your joy, your truth.

So, for example, breaking through a relationship that doesn’t serve you instead of sticking through and it being like “Well, I’m learning lessons, I’m learning to be more compassionate” of just being like “Hey, I can just end this relationship, even if we’re married, even if we have kids, even if have all of this history together because at this moment it’s not serving me and I would actually rather step away from it than suffer, suffer and suffer to try to make this work when I actually don’t really want to.” 

[28:09] Tatyana: 

You cannot marry yourself to potential, you cannot. Do not create a relationship with potential because potential is (God bless potential) but potential is that; potential is something that has not quite blossomed yet and that’s where it will always be. This is an energy that we have given the word potential, and we’re coined this word to corral our thoughts around so we all can agree on what this energy means, and potential means what? That it’s a some day (it’s a ‘someday’ energy), so it’s just doing what it does; it’s a someday energy, it’s not ever going to be. And so, the hurt, the addiction to suffering is because you’re afraid of being revealed in terms of how much joy do you contain, and maybe you’re not as friendly as you say you are; maybe you’re more quiet; maybe you’re not as quiet as you say you are, or maybe you’re more friendly. Talk about posers – No!          

[29:20] Sahara:  

So, I think a lot of people genuinely don’t know who they are, they genuinely don’t know how friendly, or this, or that, because we’ve constantly been striving; we’ve constantly been going from one thing to the next, that the energy has been really focused externally, outward, on the next goal, that most of us have not taken an opportunity to really just know ourselves. What do you recommend someone do, given that they’re living an ordinary life and they can’t leave for 10 years, to get to know “What is it that I truly want? Who am I?”

[29:51] Tatyana: 

Well, first of all, the word ‘ordinary life’ – it’s like all of you out there; if you’re alive, that’s not ordinary! You guys are probably too young to know what an Iron Lung is, Sahara, do you know what an Iron Lung is?

[30:05] Sahara:  

I do not.

[30:06] Tatyana: 

Okay. In the 1950s there was this thing called Polio. Have you heard of Polio?

[30:13] Sahara:  

Yeah, I have. There are vaccines for it still, that’s the only reason why I know.

[30:19] Tatyana:  

Exactly! It’s been eradicated. There used to be this disease that people got, especially children, any age could get it.

[30:28] Sahara:  

Tell us what it was like before Wi-Fi (no I’m kidding).

[30:30] Tatyana: 

But really, it’s the truth. At my time, I need to see, that’s why when I work with people, I want to know what year you were born so that I can see the generation that you’re coming from and the influences, it’s very important.

An Iron Lung was literally this machine that they put you in to breath because you would get paralyzed, almost like you broke your neck, but it was a virus, and it affected the muscles in your body and they all went to sleep, literally to sleep. And so, this big, huge tube, you were put in this tube (and I don’t know how it works) but it would compress and express oxygen in a way that you were being breathed. The only thing that hung out was your head, and they would have mirrors on the ceilings so that you could see; and sometimes they had a slow rotation so at least it swung so that your blood could be moved. In another words, you were paralyzed in a tube and you looked at the ceiling, for the rest of your life. 

So, an ordinary life – yeah, put you in one of those for not even 24 hours, half a day, that’s your life, where that room and that ceiling is your life? No! No! There is no ordinary life! You’re walking, you’re breathing, you have the capacity to go outside to be in the sun, or the snow, or the sleet or rain, or the humidity – you have the capacity to move your body wherever you want to move it; when you want to move it – You’re alive! There is nothing ordinary about that!  

Now, stop complaining and just start at square one, because that’s the other thing – people do not want to take steps; people want to go from A-Z. And I’m not saying we have to go from A-B-C-D-E, each step, but there are steps, there’s a journey (let’s call it that if it’s more palatable), there is a journey you see. And so, your ordinary life (I’m now telling you) is not ordinary – it’s life; it’s yours! Get excited about it being yours! Okay, and if you have to work and you’re trying to make rent, and you’re trying to make your car payment; and you’re trying to make enough money for your dog’s food – I get it, but you still get to do that! 

We need to go into appreciation more. We need to understand what does appreciation feel like. What is appreciation? And what does it feel like? Because when you can get happy about being able to feed your dog and get gas in your car, now we’re talking! There is no ordinary life! When somebody dies, and they were part of your ordinary life, you still miss them, why? Because they were a part of this life; this life! Everybody wants something extraordinary now; they want something phenomenal; they want something out of this world; they want to be the only one – well you are the only one, in the truest sense of being the only one; there is no one like you, no one, and there never will be, there never will be – let’s start there! Look at yourself in the mirror. Even identical twins, I never knew this, identical twins – one zygote, one egg that splits and you get two beans out of one egg – did you know they have their own fingerprints? They’re mirrored fingerprints (they are fingerprints that mirror each other) but they still are not identical fingerprints. There is nothing in life that is identical. So ordinary doesn’t exist, we have to develop a relationship with being alive, and that’s being lost today; it’s truly being lost. And I feel media has, that’s one of its little culprits, I’m not blaming it, but that’s one of its culprits – but let’s use diversity to inspire ourself, not to intimidate ourself; and there’s steps. I may not be able to afford that, but I can afford this and if it’s enough like that and it makes me happy.

[35:04] Sahara:  

So, what practices do you recommend for people to feel more alive?

[35:09] Tatyana: 

How many of you know to look into each other’s eyes and have a conversation? How many of you know how to stay quiet and stay with the conversation without thinking about what you want to say? How many of you know how to sit close to another person and enjoy that you’re with them and they’re with you? How many of you have ever had some type of intestinal problems where just being able to urinate and defecate without pain, and at your heart’s desire? How many of us had some broken bones and were in casts of any type, and now we have use of that arm or that leg? 

We go back to appreciation. How do we live a better life? When was the last time you kissed your partner and you let yourself feel their lips and their tongues, and the warmth of that little pink tongue; and you thought about it as a little pink tongue? Or you looked at your partner naked and you appreciated all the lines in their body? How many of us have sat with their grandmother “And there she goes; yeah, she’s going to be talking about what she always talks about” but to appreciate how she is so happy to have us here. My grandma would make me tortillas and I’d go visit her, and it was like I always knew what was going to happen, and she’d always take my head and kiss me on the forehead, which is the third eye, she picked cheeks and she’d always kiss me there. I always knew what was going to happen, it happened the same way every time; she’d show me where to sit, she’d put the same place mat; she’d go start the tortillas, but there was a richness in that; there was a comfort in that; there was a comfort in the knowing what was coming next; there was a comfort in that. So, do I miss my grandmother? I miss her actions. I miss what we shared. It’s not so much my grandmother, it’s what we shared, it’s what we heard from each other, it’s the aromas in the kitchen and the taste of the fresh tortillas, hearing them slap back and forth in her hands because she would do that little slap, slap, slap thing, because she would make them by hand. I remember all of that! How many memories do we have of being with people and places? That’s all we’re looking for in life – is these beautiful scrapbooks of what we’ve experienced. And you talked about people who have had pain – do you know that every 7 years our cells sloth off? So, we’re an entirely new being. Every, not exactly on the 7th year, but every 7 years or so we are an entirely new being. So, whatever was damaged at one point; whatever was violated at one point (in terms of our body) no longer exists physically, it only lives in our mind as a memory. And you are feeding that memory. If you were to get amnesia somehow, by a knock on the head, and you didn’t have that memory anymore about how you were hurt or raped or incest or betrayed or mom left the home, dad was drunk all the time, if you got a little bump on the head and you couldn’t remember that, you didn’t have that anymore – how would our lives change? It would, they’d have to because you wouldn’t have that obstacle anymore, you wouldn’t have that go-to place. Every time you start to venture too far away from “Well I was hurt”, you know we always look back and can’t get too far from that chair. So, is it easy to let go? No! Because the fear is, if you let go that time, that you are hurt, you’re going to have no excuses anymore for not living, for not participating and I know you want to participate because when you guys hug me and kiss me at the workshops and places, there is so much warmth in your arms and your lips, there’s so much warmth, there’s so much appreciation for me, there’s so much excitement for being at the event, there’s so much, much, much, there’s just a lot of muchness. And I know people want to share that and it’s impossible to share that when you’re sitting in the chair of remorse. 

[40:20] Sahara

I love that! That’s so beautifully said and something that you spoke about was, you see a lot of times people who do personal development work, whether it is workshop, event, even listening to a podcast, they get very excited, they may have been listening to everything that you just said, nodding along “You’re right!” How do we change that excitement, that inspiration into actual transformation? 

[40:44] Tatyana

Transformation, yes, yes. I’m all about transformation, let us transform these selves that are suffering. And the first thing I would love for you to do as the audience, is to know it’s not about “I’m worth it”, no self-worth, no self-care, no authenticity, get away from these terms and be you, be my Diana, be my Anthony, be my Phillip, be my Ashley, be my little sweetie-pies; be my sweetie-pies and know that you want something different; you want it different; you want to be that sweetness that you feel, that beauty that you feel, that tenderness that you feel. Do you know who are the most tender people that I ever encounter? Are men, men and boys, because they’re so accustomed to not being hugged and to not being cherished. And when I go to any kind of events or I lead some seminars or something, I have men, boys especially, boys, young men. By that I mean up to about 30. They are the ones that just melt into my arms because they know it’s sincere, it’s a sincere moment. I have no ulterior motives and they’re safe. They’re safe because I have no ulterior motives. And it’s in that safety that their body melts into mine. So, the motivation is, I want you to know, audience, I want you to know that what you are dying to express, is this tenderness that you are, the sincerity that you are, this beautiful presence and this smile and when your eyes look at me, and the clarity. When you feel safe, your whole demeanor changes. And I want you to know, you’re the only one that can start feeling that safety. And then you can find someone like me or Sahara Rose, that, we’re sincere in what we’re doing. So we are safe, when you are going to interact with us, we are sincere in our interaction with you, we are safe, we are safe. So, you don’t have to trust anyone out there, audience, trust yourself, be your own best friend, be there, listen for yourself. Just because you’re kind, doesn’t mean you’re stupid, okay? I used to say that to my boys when I would drop them off some place when they were teenagers, I’d say “Just because I’m leaving you here, doesn’t mean I’m stupid. I know you can get into trouble, I know you can do drugs, I know you can do drinking and you probably will, but don’t think I’m stupid, as a mother”. And I’m saying this to you as an audience, be your own caretaker, take care of yourself so that you can be this delicious, scrumptious person that you show up as at my events; be that scrumptiousness, take care of that scrumptiousness, look out for that scrumptiousness. I’m not saying be wary and be suspicious, I’m saying be wise, you know what you know, you know what you know, it’s not always easy to do, but you can do it. You want to be that scrumptiousness as much as I want to have it within my distance so that I can see it and love it up. When was the last time you licked your plate clean when it came to expressing yourself? And this is what we want, and this is our universal sadness; this is the lamentation of mankind. We’re tired of cruelty, we’re tired of indifference, well then, be this beautiful, lovely, delicious cornucopia of self. And part of that cornucopia is you are not stupid, so stop playing death, dumb and blind. 

[45:14] Sahara

Yeah, thank you for sharing that. I think a lot of it is, as you said, the domestication, and I really like that term because it allows us to see that we are these wild animals, wild horses, completely free but then we’ve been taught to stay in our confines and behave a certain way and let our boss or teacher or whatever, essentially ride on us and tell us how to go and if we gallop a little too fast we’re kind of whipped in and put back into shape, and then eventually, we’re put out into these free open fields but we think that we’re still attached. There’s this beautiful meme, I don’t know if you saw it, maybe some audience members have, of a horse that’s just tied onto an empty trash can. The trash can has no weight but the horse is just stuck there and standing there, and this is how most of us live our lives, we think that we’re attached to something, but the horse could’ve actually just moved and been totally free.

So, can you share a little bit more about this domestication, how it shoes up, how do we know if we are domesticated? I see it a lot on the dance floor of people who, especially at ecstatic dances, they don’t know what to do, they’re looking around at everyone around them thinking they need to do choreography or something else to impress someone and it shows up in all areas of our life. So what is this domestication look like? How do we free ourselves from it?

[46:37] Tatyana

Domestication essentially means how we were programmed. Domestication started out as an essential component of being human. Domestication, simply said, is a set of rules, a set of guidelines that we have all agreed to. And in the beginning we agreed to them because it was as important as a people fledging humans on Earth, surviving. So, domestication was “Don’t eat all the food, there’s four of us here”, or the domestication was splitting the duties apart. The domestication was a set of guidelines that were set up in order to ensure that mankind would, could flourish and thrive, but what started out as a lifejacket became a straightjacket. So, domestication started out with really good intentions in terms of “Well, if we don’t run the red light, there’ll be fewer accidents”. So, domestication, first of all, to explain what it is, it’s a set of rules meant as guidelines, but if you hear it, they’re guidelines, guidelines to help you in your daily life. But when a rule transgresses and becomes like a dictatorship, where there’s no choice, because even a rule has some potential of stretching, but when that rule ventures into the territory of being an actual dictatorship – that’s what’s happened with domestication today. We are all born into societies that “This is how it’s done, this is how it’s always been done and this is how you are going to do it”. So, I want you to understand that first it was meant to assist us to live together; to live together and to thrive; to remind us of how to live the best together, then it has arrived, now, today, where it’s a dictatorship, where we must conform to these various ways of being or we’re going to be excommunicated. 

Now, that’s the second part. The second part of domestication is you want to be part of the family because, like I said, we’re a little dog pack, we want to be part of that family because in the old, old, old, original days, if you weren’t part of some kind of a tribe (family, a pod) you died, you died, that was it, you died. So it’s built into us to want to be part of a pod. So, in order to be in this pod, we follow these strictures that have been created. Now, so we go from the domestication of having guidelines to pods that were created for our own good (supposedly). Now what happens is, you come along (especially my beautiful people from nowadays) and you’re beginning to say “I don’t know about these guidelines, they don’t work for me. Well that, okay, I can see the one about stopping at a red light but I really, really don’t get why I can’t turn right on a red light, what’s with that?” So you’re starting to question these rules and you’re trying to take them back to being guidelines. You’re taking them from a dictatorship, you’re examining them as rules and what I see you all doing is trying to create guidelines because we do live together and there are many, many viewpoints, but the part that we must all understand is that when you cooperate you can have many, many, many viewpoints that cooperate uncertain guidelines and it doesn’t mean you give up your viewpoint. So, you can be Muslim, Jewish, Protestant, Catholic and agree that we pick up our dog poop and it doesn’t interfere with the personal belief, is this making sense to you? Yeah. So, domestication has become distorted. There was a point and there can be a point again where it assists us to live together in harmony and with respect, but they’re not dictated forms of living that says “If you don’t live this way, we will excommunicate you”, and this is what we are all afraid of. In the end, everybody listening, everybody listening, myself included at one point, I was terrified of not being included and I’m no longer terrified of that because I know that whether or not I belong to a certain family, a certain village, a certain pod, I still have life surging within me and an expression still attempting to make its way out, and that what keeps me very happy and very safe, is my own self-expression.

[52:10] Sahara

I love that and I think everyone does. Whether they know it or not, they have this fear of being discluded, even the people who are like “I don’t give a fuck what people think about me”, we all have this underneath us and I do think a lot of it is ancestral, kind of biological, as you said, because we could’ve literally – I mean if our tribe decided to excommunicate us, we would be out in the cold, with no food, no shelters, but we still have that in our DNA but it’s no longer the truth. I mean, if you look at the truth, most of us, especially in this generation, are by ourselves all the time, so now we’re so afraid of being discommunicated by people who actually we’ve never even met, a lot of them, which is just this very interesting. If you’re trying to fit into a culture, a group of people that doesn’t really, truly exist, is just this shared ideology or it’s wherever you happen to have been born in this life. I was born in Michigan and this is what people in Michigan do, not knowing that that was just Act 1, and you have Act 2, Act 3, Act 4, Act 5 but you’re so stuck on making Act 1 work and the movie can’t go on.

[53:17] Tatyana

Exactly! And I love that analogy! And I want the people, I want the audience to get excited that there’s more, there is more. And do not be so harsh on yourself if you have employment right now, and it’s 8am-5pm, you’re working, God bless you! Thank you, thank you very much! Be excited though, be excited like Sahara said about the next Act, the next day, the next moment because it is exciting and we made it.

I know Miguel Ruiz, who was my mentor, he wrote “The Four Agreements” and he used to say “When you look at yourself say I won” and the first time I heard that I though “I won, okay, I won what”, he said “No, that egg and that sperm, they created you, won. That little sperm that got into the egg and created you Tatyana, won, you won, you won the race, and I thought “Oh my God, yes, because there were lots of sperms, there were lots of ways I could’ve been created and look like but I look like this, this is what won”. And you are exciting, we are exciting, stop looking at yourself as this 3-dimensional person that has no future simply because you feel you don’t make enough money or you don’t have a boyfriend or a girlfriend or you’re undecided in terms of gender. You’re alive, you’re alive and you have your self-expression and that’s got nothing to do with gender, it has everything to do with your heartfulness and your creativity, you see. Be excited about something in your life. Find something to be excited because relationship does not have to be with another person but eventually you do have to be in relationship with something, if not someone. 

I know when you were writing your book, perhaps I should ask you, I mean, I’m sure you got into a very deep relationship with that project and other things didn’t exist, it was you and the project and the book.

[55:36] Sahara

One hundred percent! I had to actually give up so much to be able to give my full self to that relationship because I knew that that was the highest use of my energy. And because of that, that means maybe letting go of spending as much time with friends or even being friends with certain people who may have held me back from giving that energy, and of course, the family and the parent bond. 


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We’ll take a quick break so I can give a shout out to our sponsors.


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[58:50] Sahara

So, something else that you said that really stuck with me was when parent’s say “I sacrificed so much for you. I sacrificed so much for you to be here, I worked so hard, I did everything for you” and you offered this perspective of “No one chose you to have sex with my biological father, that was you choice”. So, can you share a little more about that because it was really a refreshing and expansive point of view for me?

[59:17] Tatyana

I feel like I can say this as a mother, as a woman which has had children. And not to offend any people out here in my audience that are attempting to get pregnant or have had difficulty with fertility, but when I was a married woman in my first marriage I had several abortions and we were taking care. I discovered that when I take the pill, I have to take it at the same time every day. My system really clocks it in. Anyway, I got pregnant, I had abortions and I had abortions until I decided to keep that particular baby that I got pregnant with, I decided. So, I was having sex with my husband (my husband didn’t want children), I got pregnant yet again and I went to have the abortion and I decided “No, it’s not going to happen, I am going to have this baby”, I made that choice. As it turns out, I ended up getting divorced later on and I had him and 5 years later his brother, so I had an 11-year-old and a 6-year-old when we finally divorced (and I say finally because it was in the works). That was my choice, it was my choice to – I got pregnant, it was my choice to have sex knowing “Oh my God, I don’t know why this happens to us but I get pregnant all the time”. I’m being very serious right now, even having sex was frightened to us sometimes because we would get pregnant even using precautions. So, we had sex, I got pregnant, I aborted and finally I didn’t abort, and I had that child, and the marriage didn’t work and I got divorced, and I was a single parent in days when you were really single parents, I raised them 100% alone. Nobody made me do this, my children do not owe me anything. I carried them for 9 months, yeah, I carried them for 9 months, that’s the gestation period for a human being. I gave birth, yeah, I gave birth, that’s how we do it. Nobody made me do anything. This child came through as a result of my actions, my choices. This child exists because of my actions, my choices. This precious life is a gift to me. What happens then is the domestication comes to live in the house as a Nana. I don’t know in your culture, nana in my culture is a grandma. So here you are, you have this precious life and who comes to live? The nana comes, the nana domestication. You are going to do this with the child and you are going to do this with the child and you’re going to do this with the child as the parent, but the poor child comes with a whole manual of what the child is required to do; as the child, for the parents. And so, the child never gets to really understand that it is a gift, as life, to life. It’s life presencing itself; gave birth to itself; and life brought forth another segment of itself, and here it lives, this preciousness lives as a segment of itself. And then, because of domestication and because of our cultural heritage and because of cave man days, truly, all these influences converge on this precious life and snuff it out. But if it doesn’t get snuffed out, then it has to live in guilt. So usually, it’s better off getting snuffed out! I’m saying that sarcastically but it’s, often times, that’s why most of our audience right now is snuffed out – because you either get snuffed out or you live in spiritual crastration; you live ostracized; you live excommunicated; you live shunned by the very beings that brought you forth, and then you spend your life attempting to gain their love, their presence, their appreciation, their understanding, their encouragement, when the whole time it’s supposed to be the opposite. They’re supposed to encourage you because they got to be that precious life. They already got their chance; I got my chance at being that precious life. Believe me, when I was born, because of the time I was born, I was the first grandchild, I was the first niece, I was like a little doll. I was really lucky, I was like a little doll, I got to experience being a little doll, but, so, I’m saying that to say that I got my chance, I got my chance, and then when my sons were born, that’s their chance to be that special little doll, that special little being, that piece of life, having been given life by life. And you, all of you listening right now, this is what you miss, this is why you keep looking outside of yourself, for that hug, and that kiss, and that acknowledgment and that encouragement and that you’re safe, because really, in the end, who are we not safe from? We’re not safe from the very families that gave birth to us. And that’s a difficult thing to say, it’s a very difficult thing to say and acknowledge. The very people that gave birth to us, as life to life, are the very people that are not safe to be with. So then, we leave them and there’s this guilt that will permeate our every waking moment, even as we create lives, that means something, that are fulfilling, that are sweet, that are quiet and kind. We still carry the guilt that our true family is not the family we’re with; is not the family we’re celebrating with; is not the family we look forward to being with.

[1:05:55] Sahara

Yeah. I think for most people, they’re born into a family and that family gives them whatever, we can call it, lessons or background or curriculum that they first needed and then, from there, they choose to surround themselves by the family that they want to be around.

So, now, how do you; what do you recommend – let’s say you still feel like you need to see your family for holidays, graduations, funerals, weddings, but you don’t like being around them. What advice do you have around that?

[1:06:30] Tatyana

I always tell my clients that when you’re doing this type of work, my little audience members, I just adore you right now, I can just feel your energy, you’re just leaning forward and listening and thank you.

So, I say you’re being mentored, you’re being mentored right now. You’re listening to podcasts, you trust Sahara Rose, you trust who she brings on the show, you’re reading (perhaps), you’re all influencing each other on Instagram, (and Facebook even). So, you are being mentored, you are looking toward yourself, you are attempting to expand your expression. You really are, and that’s a transformation part, but I want you to do, I want you to constantly attempt to expand your expression, but don’t forget sweethearts, you’re the one doing this. Your mom and your dad, your aunts and your uncles, your cousins are not. As I get older, my cousins, of course, are aging with me and I’m beginning to see, we grew up shamanically, we didn’t grow up with all this Jesus and Heaven things, and as we’re getting older, I’m seeing my family post stuff. People are starting to pass away and we’re going to join them in Heaven, and I’m not saying this for anybody else who believes this way, I’m saying this for my particular family, so I find it very odd to suddenly see my cousin saying “We’re going to see you in Heaven”, and then their dog died and “I know my dog is waiting for me in Heaven.” What I’m saying to that is, be careful with the mentoring; you’re the one who’s looking forward to expressing more of yourself; they’re quite comfortable. So, when you go visit them, only go – I have a rule for myself, I go when I know I can be open-minded; I go when I know I can be patient and kind; I go when I know, I call or I speak to them, I attend weddings, when I know I can accept with an open heart that this is how they see it, this is how they feel it, this is their safety zone and I respect it. It doesn’t mean I have entered it or I entertain it, but in respecting it, I am there, at the weddings or the funerals or the Thanksgivings. I doesn’t mean that I am joining them, it means I am respecting their safety zones, but don’t forget, you’re the one being mentored, you’re the one that’s curious, you’re the one who wants more for yourself – they’re not doing that and we have to respect that.

[1:09:21] Sahara

Thank you so much for sharing. And, what do you recommend for people who are, maybe, marrying into a family, their in-laws are very different from them? So, sometimes, with your family, they drive you crazy but they’re your family, but with in-laws, it’s kind of these new people, so that blood love is not necessarily there. You’re kind of choosing and making yourself to love these completely new people and a lot of times, and I know, a lot of people I’ve spoken to, myself, their in-laws are completely different from them. A lot of times politically different, religiously different, so they’re the types of people that you probably would never spend time with in your normal life. So, how do you stay open to that because you want to, for the love of your partner?

[1:10:03] Tatyana

If you’re truly mentoring yourself, if you have a mentor, if you have someone you speak to, or let’s say these podcasts or what you’re using as a backdrop for self-reflection – if you’re really serious about this, then part of the transformation is going to be situations, like what you’re asking me Sahara. That will be part of the transformative process, it’s like “Okay, I’m going to go visit my parents-in-law or my boyfriend’s parents or my girlfriend’s parents.” And yes, I remember the first time I met my son, Gregory’s father, John’s parents. In those days, Mr. Young smoked cigars, and in my entire family, nobody smokes cigarettes even, and I was appalled. He would sit there in the house, puffing on these big fat cigars, I was like “Oh my God!” And today, in those days I was appalled, I was in tone of judgment the whole time, I was uncomfortable the whole time I was there, I was devastated, I wanted to get out of the house so bad. To me, I was sitting in stench, the cigar smoke. What I say now, what I do now, because my husband’s parents live a very different lifestyle; a very different lifestyle. To me, I constantly remind myself “I am the one who is seeking more expression and I see them as a bug in the jar; and I see them as curiosity instead of judgment. And it’s not easy all the time because she will definitely do things that I find very strange, but then I noticed “Is she doing things that are mean and harmful or is she doing things that are strange and odd”, and generally they’re strange and odd to me. But a couple times, something that I would judge as mean, that my family wouldn’t do that or my family would say that, and I would put it in the mean category – true. But for the most part it’s just odd behavior that I haven’t had much to do with in terms of, like you said, our family, my family.

So, what I do now, even at this age, even at this time, with any family, any family functions, I see them as bugs in a jar and I remember that I am the one that is exercising self-expression, they are not, they are not. And while I can see it as diversity, was meant to inspire, not intimidate, what I remember about the inspiration part is, it inspires me to really say “Oh boy, I’ve got to remember not to do that”. It’s not a negative but it’s kind of like a double negative, it inspires me to pay more attention to, if I was to do that.

[1:12:58] Sahara

So, how do we know when it’s teaching us more patience like a lot of people, especially around the holidays, are saying “Being around my family helps me cultivate more patience” or “You think you’re enlightened until you spend a weekend with your family and you realize you’re not”. So, how do you know it’s that, more of the lesson, or you actually just don’t need to spend time with them?

[1:13:16] Tatyana

There does come a moment, there’s absolutely a moment where you are, you’re being kind by accepting them. And I don’t mean that as talking down to them, I don’t mean that at all. I mean, you actually are being kind, you’re seeing them with a compassion, you’re seeing them as they’re a bug in the jar, they’re different, you’re able to look at it and not get offended, not getting intimidated, that’s working. But the moment that you can see that the people you’re visiting are acting in a way that is distressing to you, distressing, then no, that’s a moment you choose to not go around. You should not, ever, put yourself in a position where it’s distressing to you. 

[1:14:00] Sahara

Well, I think most people, sentiment around the holidays, it does get distressing for them…

[1:14:07] Tatyana

…but most of the distressed, most often – when my clients were saying they’re distressed – they’re being an inconvenienced. I am talking distressed.

[1:14:18] Sahara

What’s the difference between that?

[1:14:20] Tatyana

Inconvenience is – grandma is telling the same old jokes and uncle Henry is pounding on the piano and he sings off-key and “Oh my God, it’s going to be a long night”, okay. And every year at Christmas and Thanksgiving this is what we get “I could be at Sahara Rose’s danceathon”, so that’s inconvenience. 

Distressing would be that the family gets together and you happen to be a family that is very disruptive; you happen to be a family where the dynamic is a lot of yelling and screaming; you happen to be a family where (and there are some families like this) where no one holds bar when it comes to being unkind to each other – that is true distress. No one has the right to be unkind to you, nobody, which is what I stress when I say being a mother or a father, no one has the right, the right, to be unkind to you, no. So, that’s distress, because the distress comes physiologically – is, we will feel unsafe and your body does what it was meant to do, Sahara. We’ve all had anatomy classes but your body will start to tense, the heart rate goes up, the pupils dilate, we start to get clammy, hyperventilation, depending how long you’ve been sitting at the table and how long they’ve been screaming at each other. The body is doing what it’s supposed to do and what is it supposed to do? It is supposed to get you the hell out of there! The body is not judging that it’s grandma and grandpa going at it again, the body is not judging that it started because your uncle Toms’ turkey, somebody said it was too small this year, the body doesn’t do it for entry, the body just hears the screaming and the ranting and the raving, and the body does what it’s supposed to do – get you out of there – which means it goes into alert – that’s distress, and no one deserves to be in that type of an environment where your body feels unsafe and is trying to do its job. I really want to stress that part, I really want to stress the physiological part. You’re not making it up, it’s not in your head, when your heart is starting to beat faster and you’re starting to breathe more shallow and your pupils are dilating, and you’re getting kind of clammy, and yet you’re just sitting in the chair like that, but all of this is happening, it’s happening, your body doesn’t want to be there – that’s distress. 

[1:17:07] Sahara

And I think we don’t even think about the domino effect of okay, maybe you made it through that dinner but how is it affecting you the next day? And in how do you show up in your work, for your partner, for your kids, for your friends? And when you are in that fight or flight state, essentially, you’re going to react in a more fight and flight way and that’s going to create that trickle-down effect everyone you meet. And I just think we need to get rid of this feeling of “I have to do this; I have to do that because they’re my family. I have to show up!” You don’t! And I think that that’s really what your message is about, it’s like, you don’t have to do anything…

[1:17:45] Tatyana

…and they’re going to get angry and they’re going to get hurt, but if you are in this distressed mode, that is more harmful than not being encouraged by your family.

[1:18:00] Sahara

So, there’s so much more to go there, we’ll have to have another family podcast. So, to you as a freedom mentor, what does full personal freedom look like?

[1:18:13] Tatyana

Personal freedom, to me, means that I run my life, I walk through my life, I live my life, and to the best of my ability, I attempt to not let anybody’s judgments and opinions or beliefs about me interfere with what I choose to do next. Am I completely rid of being influenced (uninfluenced) by others? No! That’s an enlightened person, but I have a great deal of my hurts and my pains, and people don’t like me for this and people don’t like me for that – I mean, one of the things that I; it’s interesting that people will judge me on, often, people my age, more my age group, and it’s really funny – thank you for letting me say this, and I love the audience for this – my age group will judge me for how I dress.

[1:19:08] Sahara

You dress super-sexy! I love it! You’re in your clear heels and your pink tight dress.

[1:19:16] Tatyana

Yes, yes! And I love it! I’m my own Barbie doll! And I can afford to do it still, I’m healthy! But my age group is very offended by that – dress your age! And yet, the younger group, I call it my children, you all encourage and say, like you just did. It was so spontaneous what you just did, it was so spontaneous, and that’s what I love! So, I would love to say to the audience, you can be in two places where some people do not understand you at all and then there are others that totally champion you – and that’s where you want to go. You want to listen to those that champion you!

[1:19:57] Sahara

Yeah, I think this whole ‘dress your age’ thing needs to go die. It’s such a weird, my mom saw I got a tattoo, she was so mad, she was like “Aren’t you too old for this”, I’m like “Before I was too young for it and now I’m too old for it, so what was the age that was right?” This is always something, you know! And it’s something passed on, I don’t think she knows where that thought is coming from, it’s passed on, you’re either too old, you’re too young, you’re too this, too that, because they don’t know how to explain that it’s making them feel uncomfortable.

[1:20:29] Tatyana

Absolutely! It makes them feel uncomfortable! “That’s my daughter and she’s violated her body!” I remember the first time one of my sons got a tattoo and I remember my reaction. I remember I saw it and I went (internally) I went “Ahh” and then I went “Oh”, and then I went “Aww” and then I went “Oh, his body…”, and then I said “Tatyana, yeah right, his body, his body! Not your body, his body!”

[1:21:03] Sahara

And that’s that thing, it’s the lack of separation, it’s the umbilical cord still tied that you’re like “I created that pristine body with its beautiful skin and it’s my territory!” And even if your son is 50 years old now, your eldest son, and for many women, would still look at their 50-year-old son and be like “Have you been doing your laundry, have you been doing this, that?” Energetically, that umbilical cord is still tied.

[1:21:29] Tatyana

It’s still tied, yes. So, personal freedom is actually this umbilical cord to domestication, I love that you gave that to me. I would say that not having personal freedom means you have a nice, big, thick umbilical cord to domestication. My umbilical cord is to the divine. I’m tied to my self-expression. I’m fed by my self-expression and my uterus is the all of all, you see. So, to have personal freedom means that, little by little, I am eradicating my need to be validated; to be seen; to be heard. Please, please, who needs to see me, who needs to hear me, who needs to understand me? If you understand me, you’re going to understand me. If you don’t like me, you’re not going to like me. If I’m too direct for you, God bless you, I understand because there are other people for me that are just too diplomatic, you know, and then there we are with that, that’s all. 

So, personal freedom means me being able to self-express in the moment, regardless of what I may be feeling in terms of outside pressure. But my need, my absolute need to express is more important. 

[1:23:03] Sahara

I love that! Quotable “My umbilical cord is tied to the divine”, that is amazing. And can you tell us a little bit about how lying ages us?

[1:23:13] Tatyana

Oh, absolutely! When you tell a lie, it’s another line on your face; it’s another wrinkle in time, absolutely! Because when we lie, that means there is a truth that exists for you and it wants to be expressed, but your fear of being shunned is more powerful than your desire to express. So, you sublimate, you subjugate, you push it down and under so what you really want to say or feel or do gets pushed down. And where does it get pushed down? It gets pushed down into you physiologically. We’re not solid! And I understand why we forget this, I understand why we forget this but I’m going to give you an image and I would love you all, if I die tomorrow, remember this – Think of yourself as a collection of soap bubbles. I know we’re cellular but the image that’s easier to process is this wonderful amalgamation, this wonderful cohesion of soap bubbles. And all of these soap bubbles have created your body, it’s not solid. So, when you have these feelings that are emitted, think of that as notes, notes in a song like those little – I never took music, I’m sorry, are they called notes, the little black things with tails? Notes, right? Okay! 

So, think of feelings as being notes, and when you don’t play your song, you have to squish it back into the soap bubbles and pretty soon you have too many notes and not enough soap bubbles, and the soap bubbles start getting distorted, depending on the song that you’re squishing into it. And pretty soon we’re distended, we have bloating or we have puffy eyes or we have heavy jowls…

[1:25:16] Sahara

Which you’ve said is related to what chakra we’re out of balance with.

[1:25:20] Tatyana

Absolutely! It has to do with the chakra, it has to do with the place in life which you’re not allowing yourself to express. Lot of throat issues, lot of lung issues, they all have to do with “No, you may not say that and you may not say this”. And fingers, arthritis, all of those, diabetes – I have compassion and I understand it’s become a disease or a malady for your body, I understand, but it didn’t start out as that; it did not start out as diabetes. It started out as, believe it or not (shamanically we believe), since it has to do with sugar (the imbalance of sugar), what was sour in your life that you allowed for way too long, what was sour in your life so now you need a lot of sugar or you don’t have enough sugar but the sugar is off because you allowed sour for too long. 

And so, it’s very, very beautiful to know that age – we were never meant to age, we were never meant, we were meant to be healthy, we were meant to be vital. By aging I mean am I older now than when I was 17 and had Gregory? Yes! Have I lost some of the elasticity in my skin? Yes! Am I as tight and taunt? No! But I’m still as healthy, I’m still as vital, I still have a minimum of wrinkles because I refuse to put anything into my soap bubbles that doesn’t belong there, other than elation; other than a sweet anticipation; other than anything sweet and beautiful. I will not put anything ugly into myself, I won’t. 

And as far as energy vampires – oh please, vanquish them for now! There is no such thing as an energy vampire! We are each our own domain, our own kingdom, and right now, if I am influencing you in any way, it’s because I’m influencing you. But I am not being integrated into you. I do not have an ‘in’ into your body or your energy, nobody does, that is sacred terrain! 

[1:27:52] Sahara

That is a really interesting point you brought up because a lot of people – okay, the huge spiritual talk right now on Instagram is being an empath and really having to be careful of who you’re around; being very energy-sensitive, and then this term ‘energy vampire’. And I have experienced it, I have experienced certain people, when I’m out of their presence, I feel worse, I feel down, I feel like when I was in conversation with them, they’re asking me a lot of questions and prying. So I have felt that but I can’t put the blame on them, it was a level of my receptivity that allowed that to happen and also my lack of putting a boundary when I noticed it happening. So, yeah, I’d love to hear what your thoughts are right now that so many people are realizing that they’re empathic (which everyone is) but it’s holding them back from having interactions with a lot of people.

[1:28:42] Tatyana

Absolutely! Throw those books away, call me instead, Jesus Christ! The way I say it is there are two ways to collect information. Like Miguel made “The Four Agreements”, he simplified, and I’m simplifying; please, I am simplifying. But I simplify collecting information to two paradigms. There is the Empath and the Clairsentient. I am a clairsentient. When I collect information, remember I’m just an amalgamation of soap bubbles and all we do, all day, all of us, is emit and receive, emit and receive. And so, when I collect information in my day, I just know what I know. I know what I know, “Oh, he’s not very happy because of the language he’s using, let’s say”. If I was with you, and you’re an empath – I like to say it this way: You and I go to a party, and Susie and Joe are in the corner, and they’re canoodling, okay? And they’re both married to different people. I look over and not seeing and “Woo-woo-woo”, I just look over and go “Aha, something’s going on over there!” How can I tell in two seconds? The hair tossing and giggling and the way her breasts are coming out and the way he’s leaning on the fire mantle and has all masculinities on display and all her femininity is open and receiving. Okay, anybody knows something’s going on over there. You look over as an empath, you see the same thing, you say the same thing. However, you go one step further, you feel the energy. To me, I received the information, something’s going on over there. You received the information, something’s going on over there. However, you take it a step further and you can feel it. So, you’ll feel the giddiness; you’ll feel the lust; you’ll feel a little bit of guilt; you’ll feel a little bit of self-consciousness because it’s at the party. Do you understand what I’m saying? You’ll feel, you’ll feel what you just saw in terms of “Oh, something’s going on over there”. I don’t feel that as a clairsentient. 

The pros and the cons, the number one that I want to say, it’s just information. You felt the lust, you felt the giddiness, you felt a little bit of their self-consciousness – it’s just information! It’s nothing for you to do anything about! What happens with empaths is, you start sticking your fingers in everybody’s pie and making whatever’s going on around you your business, it’s none of your business, it was information. It’s like if you’re walking past a window and some lady or man is undressing and you see them half naked – information, nothing to report to the police (number one). 

Number two: Because it’s information, you have not been educated. We should really educate our children so that you know from early on, you’re an empath or you’re a clairsentient. What happens with empaths, my empath people, is you’re very sensitive because you feel the energy, you feel the information. I want you to remember it that way. “I’m an empath, I feel the information”, “I’m a clairsentient, I just know the information.”

So, what happens with my empath people, is because they feel the information, they immediately start getting involved with the information, and it’s none of their business. So they can look clingy and they can come across as little bit nosy, they can come across a do-gooders (is that a word, am I saying that properly? A do-gooder?) but always trying to get involved, but what they’re really trying to do is rectify the situation so they don’t have to feel it anymore. Peacemakers – they want to tamp out the fire that they’re perceiving, it’s none of their business. But you can understand why they’re going around and tamping out fires all the time, because they’re feeling the fire, they’re feeling the heat, so to speak.

[1:32:56] Sahara

Or just completely withdrawing, which is what I see and I hear a lot of them do.

[1:33:01] Tatyana

That’s the other thing I was just going to say, thank you. Yes, they become recluses or they can’t go anywhere “I can’t go anywhere. I can’t go to the restaurant. I can’t go to the dance”. They can’t go anywhere; they can’t stand to be around anyone.

Okay, let’s go into the energy of the vampire really quick here. No one can suck on you, think of yourself. I’ll leave you with an image, think of it as a ratchet, you know the old-fashioned things you would put under the car and go click, click, click and it lifts the car? Okay! If you vibrate, if you resonate, normally at a 50, and you go to a party and aunt Joey is there, and she resonates at a 20. When you talk to her, she has the opportunity to ratchet up to you or you have the opportunity to ratchet it down somewhat to her, if not all the way. What’s it going to be? Are you going to ratchet it down to her and join her in and commiseration of her dog dying?

[1:33:58] Sahara

Yeah, I don’t even know if someone can just raise up their vibration instantly in a conversation. I think it becomes the responsibility of the higher person to go down.

[1:34:05] Tatyana

No! No! You stay where you are; you stay where you are, that’s where you’re happiest. I’m a 50, that’s why I’m happy, that’s where I live, that’s my terrain.

[1:34:16] Sahara

But don’t you think if you tell someone “So, tell me about your past lives” and they’re so not there for it that you can create more separation with them that you kind of have to find something that like “What did you think of the Superbowl”, that they could have a conversation too, to make them feel comfortable?

[1:34:33] Tatyana

Yes, but having conversations that feel other people is different from ratcheting up or down in your energy level. 

[1:34:40] Sahara

But those conversations do bring you down because you’re kind of talking about something you don’t care about. 

[1:34:44] Tatyana

Then I would say you’re going to have to practice caring, because are they asking that much of you? 

[1:34:53] Sahara

It’s like, you know when you have to have small talk? For me, I feel like small talk drains me. I don’t want to talk about the weather and this new movie, I don’t even watch movies you know.

[1:35:05] Tatyana

So then, you’re telling me, though, if you change – because I hear what you’re saying, if you don’t want to have a small talk that you are going to change it to what you do want to talk about. And you’re telling me when you do change into what you do want to talk about, they don’t want to talk? 

[1:35:20] Sahara

Yeah, and it can even create more separation because they think it’s so out there.

[1:35:25] Tatyana

Okay. In that case, then they walk. But what I hear now is “I don’t want them to walk. I feel guilty that they walk, I’m supposed to entertain them.”

[1:35:34] Sahara

Well, it’s like, I think that that’s what a lot of spiritual people, like, that’s why they become isolated because they go to their BBQ or whatever at work and the type of things that they’re pondering about, most people have not even gathered the awareness that it exists, so for them to have that BBQ conversation, they have to bring their vibration down. 

[1:35:54] Tatyana

If they were the last people on Earth, if the people of the BBQ, I can assure you that the fact that the Jones’ wanted to talk about their cacti collection, it would be the most interesting thing they could ever hear. What we’re doing here is, I’m saying, we’re human and we must begin to understand that the diversity was meant to inspire. 

I once went to a dinner and the man I was seated by was an engineer. And he proceeded to tell me how he installed his air conditioning unit and he told me every single detail about how he measured, how he micro-measured and then he told me how he figured out how he could use different sized (true story) screws to save money, and then in the end he ended up saving, I think it was $2 and some cents by figuring out the screw sizes and switching them over. And I was fascinated with the fact that someone would do that! That’s what fascinated me! Not so much the conversation about the air conditioning unit, but the fact that this human, his consciousness, he used it such so that he measured screw distanced and screw sizes and the pennies on the screw and he saved, I don’t know after how many hours he put into that calculation, but he saved $2! It’s fascinating! Fascinating! My husband fell asleep at the table.

[1:37:23] Sahara

Right! So, what I’m hearing you say is, sometimes it’s not just the conversation but it’s finding why that person would even find that conversation interesting and finding just that that horror movie was just so interesting to them to really think about their lives and where they’re at. 

[1:37:41] Tatyana

Find them interesting. Find the curiosity. Find your curiosity in everything you do because everything, if you don’t understand it, everything is curious, it’s like “Why? Wow, why?”

[1:37:57] Sahara

And then what if someone feels like the energy vampire – it’s not an interesting conversation, it feels like it’s draining you, how do you protect yourself? Do you believe in protecting your energy? That’s a big question right now.

[1:38:08] Tatyana

I never protect myself, I don’t even think about it. I’m not stupid, I don’t get myself in situations that I don’t want to be in. I’ve never been mugged, I don’t intend to be mugged. I’ve never had bad things happen to be and I don’t intend to have them happen to me. 

If I’m unsure about something, I don’t do it; I don’t do it! You know those banana boats in Cabo San Lucas that everybody loves, riding those banana boats over the waves and everything? So, I got on, on one, with my sons and their girlfriends and everybody’s…I was excited till it started up and then I said “Oh fuck no!” And they had told me if you want to get off to do that, cut your neck off, you know. And they had just barely started and I went “Stop, stop, stop!” And he was sweet, he stopped the boat immediately and I got off and I climbed into the boat and the girls were saying “Oh come on Tatyana, come on, you can do this”, I was “Oh yeah, I can do it, I don’t want to hold onto that damn thing. I don’t want to be thinking that I’m going to be thrown off and I’m going to go on the rudders and chopped into a million pieces, no, no! I’ll sit in here and watch you guys.” See, immediately, no matter how preposterous my fear was, because my fear was getting chopped up into tuna, by the propeller, and they’re saying that’s impossible. I don’t care, that’s what I’m thinking, that’s what I’m feeling, I’m getting in the boat. I don’t question my desire to not do something and I don’t let anybody else influence my desire to not do something. 

[1:39:38] Sahara

So, what I’m hearing you say is, if you can find something interesting in that person, let yourself experience it, and if not, excuse yourself.

[1:39:47] Tatyana

Absolutely! Who says you have to talk to them? Who says? I mean, when my neighbor invited us to dinner, and we went, and this is what transpired, well we didn’t go to dinner with them anymore. That’s all! But also, it was 50:50 because I know for a fact they didn’t like what I talked about and they were uncomfortable about it. I discovered that they were very, very into their church and their belief systems, and I made them very uncomfortable. And I asked questions that made them very uncomfortable, about their beliefs, about God. And so, no. We see each other, we love each other, we hug each and kiss when we see each other, but no more dinners.

[1:40:31] Sahara

Hmm…yeah. And I think that we feel that guilt of “Oh, well, you know, I met up with them so now we’re kind of on the track to become friends and I should still see them”, and it’s like what if you just trust that “No, that friendship might not have been for me”. Imagine how much drama we would have saved ourselves from in our lives if we just trusted them, and then they probably felt the same way too but here we are, thinking in our heads that everyone wants to hang out with us, when it’s definitely not the case. 

[1:40:56] Tatyana                                                           

Oh, I know that people take me – I’m very spontaneous and I know that I can be very quiet but I know that I’m spontaneous, and I know I can be very quiet also. But for the most part, I’m a very, very enthusiastic person let’s say, and I know that that energy is very off-putting to many people – my enthusiasm. They call it “You’re so intense” and I go “I don’t see myself as being intense”, but I’ve heard that enough times to believe that to many people, I am very intense. 

[1:41:30] Sahara

I hear that too. And now I just know there’s a lot of people I find too slow, you know, and I can’t; you’re going to breathe in between every word, I just literally can’t be friends with you, just like you don’t want to be friends with me. I talk really fucking fast.

[1:41:48] Tatyana

Yes, see, but that’s the beauty when we can truly say “I love being friends with Suzie because Suzie is at my pace and I love it! And Tatyana, when she comes to the party, yeah that’s fine but I like when she stays in her corner with Sahara!”

[1:42:06] Sahara

And they’re so damn loud, can they turn it down a little?! What are they wearing? They’re twerking, what? No!

[1:42:13] Tatyana

Yes, yes, exactly! But then if we could be at peace with that, then that’s where the harmony is. It’s not asking us to change who we are, it’s asking us to be at peace with what is. And if it’s not peaceful for us, like you mentioned the word distress, if it’s distressing to us, then that means that your body is telling you that it’s gone past uncomfortable; it now feels dangerous, okay. So, when I was sitting on back of that banana (that sounds funny right now), but when I was sitting on that banana, my body told me “Distress” and I honored it immediately, I got off the banana.

[1:42:51] Sahara

Yeah, I think a lot of us were like “If I were brave, I would stay on that banana or I would jump off this cliff.” We were just in Hawaii and my husband’s like “Let’s jump off a cliff”, I’m like “No part of me wants to do that”, he’s like “Come on, be brave”, I’m like “There’s no reward on the other side. First of all it’s cold; second of all I don’t want to risk my life”. And I think it’s like, choose your battles, you don’t have anything to prove to anyone. Even this idea of doing the thing that scares you – do it if it brings you joy but don’t just do it for the sake of doing it, that’s just torture.

[1:43:25] Tatyana

No, no. You’re proving that you’re brave to whom and why? “I’m brave? I’m brave?” I had a baby! That’s brave, okay! Or “I got pregnant”, that’s brave! Or, “I helped my son move to San Francisco one time, all by myself, and he and I and his little girlfriend”, that’s brave, in my book okay, in my book. Brave for you jumping off a cliff? Go for it, I’ll watch and I’ll cheer when you land.

[1:43:55] Sahara

Yeah, it comes down to, again, redefining what every word means to us – what freedom, what brave, what happiness, what joy, what distress – what do these words mean to us instead of taking the culturally defined definition of it.

[1:44:09] Tatyana

And that’s personal freedom. I don’t let other people’s understandings of the situation influence my perception of the situation. That banana was perfectly benign to my daughter-in-laws and my sons, perfectly benign yellow banana, it was not benign to me, it scared me, I wanted off – that’s personal freedom. And I didn’t feel like I was being a party-pooper, no. Or even like…

[1:44:42] Sahara

Yes, that was self-love for you, at that moment.

[1:44:44] Tatyana

Yes, or like an old lady trying to be brave “Oh, I’m not going to be an old lady”, no, I got off the god damn banana!

[1:44:52] Sahara

Get off the banana guys! If you don’t like it, leave the banana! This is our takeaway for you.

Oh, well thank you so much for being on the Podcast and diving so deep with all of us. I’ve spent the past 4 hours talking to you today, and it’s been amazing.

Where can listeners connect with you, work with you, learn about you more?

[1:45:11] Tatyana

How do you guys say it? Educate me over here okay, because I always forget? Because first, the natural thing I do is “Here’s my phone number”.

[1:45:19] Sahara

You don’t need to give out your phone number, that’s a lot of calls.

[1:45:22] Tatyana

Because how are they going to reach me?

[1:45:24] Sahara

Do you have an email?

[1:45:27] Tatyana

I have an email. Okay, first let’s start with my email.

[1:45:28] Sahara

Or a website? Let’s start with your website.

[1:45:30] Tatyana

Okay, tatyanarae.com 

[1:45:41] Sahara

And I’ll have that link in the show notes too.

[1:45:43] Tatyana

Okay. And then I’m at 1-800-RENT-A-GODDESS

[1:45:50] Sahara

What does that mean Rent a Goddess?

[1:45:52] Tatyana

Well, actually, it came about because when I assist people I realized they would take me off the shelf and we would talk and have a really good session and then for a week or two they would put me back on the shelf. 

[1:46:08] Sahara

I love it, a Goddess!

[1:46:11] Tatyana

Yeah, well, I would prefer that they take me off the shelf and throw me in their pocket and carry me with themselves so that we had some transformative energy going, not just the energy of being inspired and motivated. So, 1-800-RENT-A-GODESS really meant don’t make it just for now, let’s make this a life-changing episode.

[1:46:36] Sahara

Yes! I’m sure it will be and I believe that your contact box is on your website too, so people can contact you there too. You can give out your email too, if you want to.

[1:46:46] Tatyana

Yes, yes, I love that, yeah. It’s all consonants, so it’s [email protected] (so it’s naked bliss – no vowels, ‘naked bliss’).   

[1:47:09] Sahara

I wish my grandma’s email was naked bliss! Awesome! But you actually do remind me of my grandma on my father’s side because she had a child when she was 14, she was in a child marriage, but because of that I think she doesn’t give a fuck what anyone thinks. Her husband died when she was 27, so she’s been a widow most of her life and because of that, being a widow back in Iran, you were completely excommunicated. So, I think she’s lived her whole life just already being shunned, so she just speaks her truth, she says whatever she wants and she’s so funny. We brought her on a vacation to the Dominican Republic, she was probably 88 years old at the time, she comes out in lingerie and walking around the pool and we’re like “Grandma, you have to wear a bathing suit” and she’s like “I want to wear lingerie” and just, no fuck’s given, like a boss! 

[1:48:01] Tatyana

I love that, yes, yes! No, you get to a point, it’s not that we’ve suffered a lot, but you get to a point when you realize that the ups and the downs that you have had just enhanced, they gave you more stories. Life should be a scrapbook! Make it a scrapbook, don’t make it an obituary, make life a scrapbook!

[1:48:20] Sahara

I love that! Well, thank you again so much for sharing! 

[1:48:23] Tatyana

Thank you and goodbye little peeps, I love you all! I just could squish you! You know, when something’s so delicious you just want to pop it? That’s how I feel! Thank you so much for listening and thank you for inviting me on.

[1:48:38] Sahara

Thank you.

[1:48:39] Tatyana

Thank you! Love you! Bye-bye

[1:48:40] End of Interview         


[1:48:41] Sahara

Zhan-girl! Tatyana fits that fire! She is fierce, she is bold, she is not afraid of being out there but really, her out there is really being in here, really being in her heart and in her truth and we are just not so used to that in our society that that feels confronting even though she’s just being herself.            

[1:49:02] Sahara

So, loved that conversation with her! She is such a power house! Be sure to check her out! And we have conversations on topics like this – being authentic, stepping into your truth in Rose Gold Goddesses.

[1:49:14] Sahara

This entire month of June we are going to be working with an archetype which I won’t list here, we’ll share it with you in Rose Gold Goddesses. But stepping into your fullest expression, your joy, your fun, your ease, your flow, and tapping into some of the past lives that you may have that you’re not fully stepping into that are kind of swimming around in your subconscious waiting for you to actualize them. So, that’s what’s happening this month in Rose Gold Goddesses, it is going to be juicy, full-powered, lit-train and I invite you to hop on it! 

[1:49:49] Sahara

So, if you are interested in joining a community of over 2000 Spiritual Soul Sisters, who listen to this Podcast, who love to meditate and pull cards as much as they love to twerk and release their fullest expression. 

This month I also have a new workshop in Rose Gold Goddesses called Healing and Embodiment Through Dance. So, if you are looking to fully express yourself, your body, your temple is your ultimate tool. So, I’ll be sharing with you practices, different isolations that you can do; why we are so disconnected to our bodies; and really guiding you back home so you can dance and be free and express, and actually heal trauma and fully embody your dharma through dance.

So, this is all available for you! Dozens of my programs, my Discover Your Dharma talks that I’ve done, my Awaken Your Powers Masterclass with Shaman Durek, all of the previous month’s Goddess Circles from Kali Ma – transformation, to Lakshmi – abundance, to Saraswati – creativity, to Yemaya – flow, to Brigid – reemergence, the list goes on. All of this, literally, hundreds of hours of content and our very own App with this epic community; weekly live workshops; everything is there for you in Rose Gold Goddesses.

So, I invite you to join us, the link is rosegoldgoddesses.com the link is in the show notes and I am soul excited to meet you inside.


If you loved this Episode, I would love to send you a free gift which is the first half of my unreleased book “Eat Right for Your Mind-Body Type“. This is a different book than “Eat Feel Fresh“. My first book ever which is not released anywhere, and I am gifting it exclusively to those who leave a review of my Podcast in the iTunes store. So, all you’ve got to do is head over to iTunes where you’re maybe listening to this Podcast and leave a review, take a screenshot that you’ve left it and email it over to me at [email protected] and I will send you back the first half of my unreleased book “Eat Right for Your Mind Body Type“, which goes all into Ayurveda, Doshas, Plant-Based Nutrition, Body Types – all of the things in a really fun and engaging way. So this is my gift to you for free for supporting the Podcast. Every single review I personally read. It really helps the Podcast be listened to by more people so we can raise the vibration of the planet together, and I am soul grateful to have you on this journey.

Thank you so much for listening and I’ll see you on the next episode. Namaste.

Episode 290: How To Free Yourself From Society’s Domestication with Tatyana Rae
By Sahara Rose


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